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Post by brillo451 on Sept 24, 2011 23:18:56 GMT
neils I suppose you got the bus and such a good price of £2150 so all you have to do is get a can of white gloss and get some saltires on it and rip out the bottom floor put a small cooker and sink in it, Then it is a motorhome and you can drive it on a standard licence.... lol
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Post by gunnerhoots on Sept 25, 2011 18:13:10 GMT
This is me all confused again!. Just planning a new cart to try and reel in a few seconds off C12,Pistonbroke Centa Brava and the rest of youse. Fair in wheels, full canopy, all part of the plan and now this!. I ve just googled sejkora carts to see what we,re all talking about, they look pretty good. All the fast carts over here go for skinny tyres and theirs are pretty wide. What I should I be building.... only one way to find out......I m with Harry Hill. Can a straight race be set up our top three versus the Spanish top three. That way we,ll know for sure and I can start my build with confidence. Looking forward to seeing you all at the Screwfix final. Lets face it anyone could win this ,its all to play for and a trip to Monaco is one hell of a prize!
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Post by stevec12 on Sept 25, 2011 21:43:14 GMT
I think you will find its a lot to do with the tracks that we race on cairngorm and dalby are fast sweeping bends where top speed and aero count for more than the ability to get around the corners fast .... tracks like richards castle i take the kojacks wih the wheel fairings off and put on the citty jets and this last time twin wheels on the rear because the cornering forces are so great and i think from the posted vid cornering counts more than the last bit of aero will see you at screwfix and see what happens to out carts on grass
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Post by team-art on Sept 26, 2011 8:57:29 GMT
"What I should I be building"Only my opinion, our tracks with a very few bends and virtually no braking required, stick with very skinny, very light bike wheels/tyres between 16”/20” for maximum speed. In Europe they use wider/smaller wheels/tyres that work better on their much more technical tracks, tracks that actually have corners, place much higher loads on wheel/tyre and also require brakes that work. Have a look at this VIU in Italy....1880m ..2min 15s. .max “about” 60mph/100kph www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvXs_CMmr4c&feature=player_embeddedCheers Rich
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Post by azuma on Sept 26, 2011 19:56:17 GMT
weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!! all them hay bales to chose from - Team rooket wouldn't know which ones to go for first !!! Seriously, though that is a cracking track - it would be good to have a course like that in the UK to go with the various courses we have. F1 eat your heart - -gravity racing don't do boring
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Post by grahamk on Sept 26, 2011 21:35:36 GMT
We planning a road trip [a href=" "] [/a]
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Post by grahamk on Sept 26, 2011 21:51:32 GMT
French rules translated to English online
Technical Réglement of C.E.C.C.A.S. - 1 - EUROQUILL COMMITTEE SHOPPING OF CASE WITH SOAP Technical regulations of C.E.C.C.A.S. Applicable from 2008 Category C1 to C4 – Case with soap 1. Definitions. Vehicle of motorised type without engine of two ways in four wheels (a different number of wheels is forbidden). Direction is operated by a closed steering wheel (no handlebar of bike). Suspensions in independent wheels are allowed. 2. Dimensions. Maximum length on 2300 mm (without the points of ties) Maximum breadth on 1200 mm Wheelbase minimum 900 mm Way minimum 500 mm (between the filled tyres, outdistances catch on the soil) Outdistance minimum recommended of the soil in floor 35 mm Technical Réglement of C.E.C.C.A.S. - 2 - Represent 1 3. Weight. Weight maximum, pilot installed in the case in complete keeping, differs for every category: In case of weight surcharge: CECCAS reserves the right to grant an infringement of maximum 10 % weighty of the category of the pilot as far as his vehicle does not exceed 100 kg, in that case definite ballasts will be not allowed. Category Weight C1 130 kg C2 150 kg C3 170 kg C4 200 kg 4. Wheels. Wheels are of a free choice, a diameter maximum tyres filled with 450 mm. 5. Brakes. Efficient brakes are compulsory on 4 wheels, they are operated by the foot of the pilot. Not of brakes on the soil. 6. Specific equipment Surgical collar portrays compulsory Go-kart for categories C1à C3, recommended for C4. 10 ° RECOMMENDED 10 ° RECOMMENDED 35 REGISTERED MIN BODYWORK BODYWORK ARCEAU OF REINFORCEMENT BODYWORK NO TIE FRAME Technical Réglement of C.E.C.C.A.S. - 3 - 7. Numbers of running. One or several numbers of running will be issued by the organizer and the site defined by this one. 8. Sanctions. The failure to observe of the present regulations, will draw away the exclusion from competition this without any infringement in the case of a running CECCAS.
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Post by neils on Sept 27, 2011 7:56:42 GMT
Unfortunately I didnt win the bus, actually i was told I would be living in it if I did lol. Anyway, road trip sounds good, new cart would be on the cards too if that was the case. So, is anyone else keen on this road trip happening? I know I am.
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Post by andy on Sept 27, 2011 8:22:56 GMT
totally agree with Azuma.....what a fantastic track, truly mouthwatering........the guys in Europe have got it spot on.. We have some great roads in the Uk,But could we put on a event of this type ? These events happen on a weekly basis across Europe. But we don't have anything that comes close........
Could we do it? Would we be allowed to do it...??.health and safety etc,etc Would there be enough interest?
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Post by Scottish Cartie Association on Sept 27, 2011 8:40:59 GMT
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Post by Scottish Cartie Association on Sept 27, 2011 9:01:43 GMT
Attached is the the calculated profile for Viu (the video above). Just loaded the data straight from google maps and smoothed the altitude data. Didn't alter the cartie parameters at all from the defaults provided. Predicted time: 131 seconds. Actual time (from vid): 135 seconds. I wonder if anyone has some real GPS data so we can get a better altitude profile. Attachments:
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Post by Scottish Cartie Association on Sept 27, 2011 10:16:35 GMT
Interesting. Been playing with various different parameters for Viu and it seems that the times are relatively insensitive to changes in aerodynamics. A cartie with a brick like Cd of 0.7 can easily beat a slick 0.3 Cd machine if it can carry just a couple of mph more through the corners, even though its top speed will be far lower. With the same carties on Cairgorm, the brick is miles off the pace. Attachments:
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Post by bad attitude racing on Sept 27, 2011 17:11:51 GMT
us bad attitude boys are up for a roadtrip. would be good to see what a uk speck cart could do on their courses and vice versa. not seen anything yet that would cause us any problems , except this one in belgium :-) youtu.be/P_MrMwRqKmo
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Post by stevec12 on Sept 28, 2011 20:06:14 GMT
now !!! with the heavy braking and tight turns a ( kers ) systen would be a great advantage if the engeneering coud be made to work It would need to be able to prove that there was no stored energy a flywheel that is not spinning has no energy. and as its center of mass dose not move within the cart could not be seen as moveable balast. so if it was just the breaking force through a gearbox that was used to turn the flywheel and then that flywheel used to return the energy after the corner . would it be alowed
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Post by neils on Sept 28, 2011 22:21:01 GMT
As rules stand at moment I wouldnt have thought so, BUT, in the interests of research and development it may be worthwhile having a seperate class for innovations such as these energy harvesting machines
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Post by Scottish Cartie Association on Sept 29, 2011 9:12:55 GMT
It would depend on how each individual race organiser wants to handle it, but the wording on the CSEx rules is pretty clear;
My interpretation of that is that KERS systems and similar are not permitted. The fact that the flywheel (for instance) was not rotating on the start line is irrelevant - it uses stored energy for propulsion so it's not allowed. Certainly the intention was not to leave a loophole to be exploited.
I agree with neils that it's an intesting technical challenge though and would be fun to try. I suspect it's lot harder than you might imagin though as there are other factors involved. For instance, you'd want to think about the axis and direction of rotation of any flywheel, as gyroscopic precession effects may be quite large and may have a rather surprising impact on handling if you get it wrong.
There is a provision under the CSEx rules that would allow a KERS machine to run;
But ... I reckon that downforce would be the better way to go, and certainly easier to implement. The analysis above, showing that increased cornering speed can outweight the extra drag, implies that there is an interesting optimisation that could be made for each course, trading off extra drag for extra downforce (and hence faster cornering).
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Post by woody on Sept 29, 2011 17:14:20 GMT
wings that provide down force in the bends could be adjusted to cause minimal drag on the straights and even to act as air brake if needed , it could be useful to slow down without putting extra demands on a tyre (if it is already giving maximum available grip to cornering etc)
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Post by azuma on Sept 29, 2011 23:24:58 GMT
Woody, moveable wings are something we have thought about, but since we are struggling to finish a build before a season finishes, its something that gets put on the backburner ......again!
Also agree with some of the roads CC has mentioned and having been to see lowther hill - -WOW. Unfortunately NATS won't allow us to use the road BAH!
It would be good to have some more events like this in the UK, but there are some who do not want their roads closed and thats before we even get into any organising.
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Post by peasnbarley on Sept 30, 2011 9:35:08 GMT
The talk is now about racing in Spain, building carts that incorporate Kers systems, possible new tracks that most of us would love to have a crack at but are not as yet available and time trials on grass. A trip to Spain if it could be arranged would be great but I could nearly guarantee it would come at a cost to other UK events. Teams are already feeling the pinch with traveling costs and accommodation and building a new competitive cart costs serious money. With speeds now in excess of 70mph and possibly increasing, the effect of 'modifications' take on a whole new dimension. Personally I feel a lot of the fun has gradually been lost for one reason or another and cartie racing has become far too intense. Certainly I want to build a cart to take on C12, Rookit, Pist'n'broke and several others but most of all I want to have fun doing it and enjoy the banter that goes with success or failure. The fun element was certainly there at the ScrewFix event and the whole event was well laid back and just for laughs with the potential for anybody to win. A race on grass would be a hoot with thrills and spills at speeds where serious accidents would be very unlikely and the cost of carts within the reach of everyone.
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Post by bad attitude racing on Sept 30, 2011 16:11:53 GMT
i think it depends on what your looking to get out of it charlie ? we wernt very competative last year but had a blast doing it. yeah we want to go faster, but we have a budget so work within that. i spent 15yrs touring the world with my band, cartie racing is my attempt to fill that void. im 40 next year and to be honest going to spain to race would be a one off, just a wee adventure with some likeminded friends. as for accidents , theres risk whatever speeds we go but if we build a safe and strong cart and drive it within our own abilities then its no more dangerous than swimming off the south african coast ;-)
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