ali
Beginner
Posts: 38
|
Post by ali on Jul 10, 2005 8:05:55 GMT
For an electronics school project i am planning to make a distanc sensor for a luge ( to show wheteher there is someone behind you) any help would be greatfully received, most importantly, would anybody be able to answer this questionnaire? 1. How useful would a sensor to show how close someone is behind you be? Very Fairly Slightly Not Very Not At All 2. What range of sensing would you expect and require? 3. Would weight and size be of importance? Weight: Size: 4. How would you want the information to be displayed? 5. Where would you want the information to be displayed? 6. Would a buzzer be useful to warn if someone is particularly close behind? Very Fairly Slightly Not Very Not At All 7. Would the casing and sensor have to resist crashes? 8. What conditions would you expect the casing to withstand? 9. Would aerodynamics be of importance? 10. How much would you expect to pay for a product of this type? MAny thanks ALasdair Morrison
|
|
|
Post by Joel on Jul 10, 2005 13:25:16 GMT
Not entirely sure how usefull it would be, or of it's commercial viability, but would certainly make for an interesting project.
To answer your questions:
1. Fairly/Slightly
2. Really depends on the course, courses like Dalby (basically a 1 mile strait) would need a longer range, Gurston less of one and at Ventnor (200m of turns) it would be useless. I guess a 20m range would be a good place to start.
3. Weight of the sensor wouldn't be so important and size shouldn't be bigger than, say a pint glass, preferably as small as possible. However the display should be as small and light as possible.
4. I think a system of LEDs indicating range, say Green for >20m, Orange for 20>10m range, Red for 10>5m and Flashing Red for <5m. I also think direction should be of equal importance so that you can take action.
5. I think an LED display as above would be best mounted on the inside of the visor, upper right and left. This would be have to be small, but more importantly would be quick easy to see.
6. Not Very. If the road is rough or you're going very fast it can be suprisingly noisy inside a helmet. I also use sound to gauge where people are in relationship to me, a buzzer would hinder this.
7. Bit of a silly question, of course it would.
8. It would have to be able to take quite a bash. I have crashed at very high speed (50mph+) and my board has fliped, rolled, slid, been dragged through the dirt, hit rocks, walls, mud banks etc. In addition any connectors between the sensor and the display would have to be crash resistant. If the display is helmet mounted then the cable must be designed to seperate with the rider in a crash, otherwise things are gonna break.
9. Aerodynamics is one of the most important things in luge, especially on longer, straiter courses where such a device would be of most use. Many luges are now being made with aerodynamic cones behind the head, if it could be fitted into one of these it would be best.
10. Not much to be honest. It could possibly be a helpfull device, but not a race winning one. There is also such a small market that an expensive device would not sell. Take Wedge helmets for example. With improved visability and allowing a better tuck they really do provide an advantage, however probably less than 1/2 of the worlds riders have one. This is because of price, and they only cost about £100.
Finally I would just like to make a final point, there are also two possible negative aspects of such a device. Firstly it could be distracting, with lights and/or buzzers indicating someone coming up behind you it could take your mind off the upcoming corner leading to a crash or taking it badly allowing them to pass. And secondly from a safety aspect it could lead to people erratically swerving to block people who are trying to pass. Taking someone out can lead to serious consequence, hence the IGSA rules stating that if someone is overtaking you cannot take action against it.
While I don't think this would have any commercial value or a huge impact on the sport I don't want to discourage you. It would be an interesting and challenging project and I may well be wrong.
Hope this helps, best of luck and keep us posted
Joel
|
|
|
Post by BOS on Jul 10, 2005 20:08:10 GMT
1. Slighty 2. 5m-0m 3. Yes As small as possible and as light as possible 4. Sound within the helmet e.g ear plugs. 5. Coming in my ears 6.Slightly 7. Oh yes 8. water resistant, impact resistant 9. Yes may be a cone shape behind the helmet would be usefull. 10. £40 max
This idea maybe more usefull to stand-up dudes as if they wanted to chuck a massive slide they would know how close people were behind them without coming out of a tuck! But yeah go for it! I look forward to seeing the results!
BOS
|
|
|
Post by Tom W on Jul 11, 2005 16:46:23 GMT
Hi Ali!
Sounds like a great idea! Luges are TOTALLY blind to the rear, so a sensor telling you what is going on behind would be very useful indeed!
Heres your answers:
1. Very.
2. I would want to know about anything up to 5 metres behind me (Any further than that and they would be out of my "wind bubble" and not in a position to overtake).
3. Make it as small and light as possible.
4. I would def want an audiable tone like those parking sensors on new cars. I hate joel's idea for lights in the helmet, how distracting would that be having to change your focal length all the time to look at something inside your helmet? Keep your eyes on the road!
5. Audiable tone in my ear - Beeping more rapidly the closer the guy gets. If you could use an ipod style earpiece that would be great, if not then a beeper mounted near the head would do, it would have to be pretty loud, as luges are very noisy to ride, and helmets muffle the ears.
6. Very
7. Yes, but if we are talking about something the size of a pack of chewing gum, we could probably carry it inside our leathers, or at least stash it somewhere safe under the luge.
8. At best, a LOT of vibration. At worst, an 80mph grind on tarmac for 1/4 mile down the road, until the luge, the rider and the parking sensor end up in a big twisted heap at the bottom of the hill.
If you are making it to carry ON the rider, inside the leathers, then I guess slimline lightweight protection would be sufficient as the leathers would protect it from the worst of a crash. (Make it as thin as poss, like a hip-flask, or a PDA handset).
If you are making it to bolt-on to the luge, then any of those standard metal enclosures you can buy from Maplin or RS would do, just make sure there is plenty of vibration padding inside. Anything bolted onto the luge will BUZZZZ! Also, make sure the enclosure has some spare 5mm bolt-holes through it. All luge hardware is attached with M5 screws, and most luges have plenty of spare holes which you could use to hold your sensor on with.
9. Aerodynamics would only really matter if this thing is too big to hide on the rider or under the luge.
10. £40
Hope this helps!
Ride hard, stay safe.
Tom W.
P.S. A couple of extra notes:
1. If you mount the sensor on the back of the luge, then provide some impact protection for it, as both ends of the luge get bashed all the time, usually transporting it around in the van.
2. If you mount the sensor on the back of the rider's helmet, then try to use a non-mechanical means (Sucker pads etc). It is not good practice to use glue on helmets, as it can affect the integrity of some helmet materials. (Plus, a lot of riders are quite protective ad their shiney hats, and would be reluctant to glue anything permanant onto them).
Another point with helmets, nobody wants to ride with wires around their neck, nor would anybody want to have a wire leading from his helmet to the luge. When you crash, the luge usually goes flying off on its own, I wouldnt want to get towed after it by the neck!
3. Could you have the sensor out on a wire, with the rest of the circuit in a box? Then we could mount the sensor remotely at the end of the luge, and have the box with the rest of the circuitry inside somewhere else under the luge where it wont get in the way. (I wouldn't really want to ride around with a big box strapped to the back of my luge!)
4. Whereabouts are you based? Do you have a luge? If not, then let us know where you are and we might be able to hook you up with a local luger for you to work with / on.
|
|
ali
Beginner
Posts: 38
|
Post by ali on Jul 13, 2005 20:44:45 GMT
THanks for all your help You have helped me on many issues, and will consider them all in th enext stage of my work
Thanks again ALi
|
|